Opinion Preston Clegg. 4) Yes my point about the megachurches was that they were not per se bad. Some are good, some are bad. From a spiritual standpoint its an even bigger (and opposite) no-brainer! If that is the last word then so be it. [9] In 1963, he was granted a Masters of Divinity from the Bible Institute of Los Angeles's new Talbot Theological Seminary, in La Mirada, California, with honors. Im sure with a church of such a size these issues are found amongst some, and appropriate discipline and loving correction are needed. Chandler only eventually took action as the wheels were about to fall off the Mars Hill bus and, sadly, only when great damage had already been done to the body of Christ. It never occurs to me for a second to not fulfill it. One such person who has joined the ranks of GTY is Cameron Buettel, author . The point you made about Matt Chandler was that he does not live as a Christian (how can you know that? Furtick preaches a different gospel. John Fullerton MacArthur Jr. (born June 19, 1939) is an American Protestant pastor and author known for his internationally syndicated Christian teaching radio and television program Grace to You. Your lack of apology (at very least regarding your amazon remarks) has only served to highlight the arrogance and childishness that you displayed in your replies. Your other comments were directly applied to the Megachurch movement I follow the goings-on of the mega church para church neocalvinist movement (call it what you will) in the USA and am frequently astounded by their antics. Again I am glad that you were not criticising the whole mega church movement (although I am sure you will understand why your initial post can be read that way).which megachurches are you happy with? Its not the first time that youve responded aggressively when a pastor that you hold in such high regard is questioned. There are doubtless many things wrong with Chandler (hes a Baptist for a start!) Were deeply grateful for that. But there is one criticism that I want to deal with in finishing. . Thanks for this. Help us continue to be a voice for truth in the media by supporting CBN News for as little as $1. (Genaro Molina / Los Angeles Times via Getty Images), Even as the pastor was sick, the church elder remained upbeat, adding, "Its pretty pretty amazing we have guys with sermons in their Bibles wherever you go and so Mikes going to be here.". Why do you think that that was disgraceful etc but G Whites bracketing of Furtick with Chandler was not? I will reply to them briefly. I might write a review later but the book is dreadful Mark Driscoll and Tim Keller, for example, are frequently careless and irreverent in the way they use Scripture. Really? The Church of England's compromise on same-sex relationships is disastrous for everyone. He has misgivings about Neo-Calvinism and he gave his reasons for those misgivings. From 20052015, MacArthur made about $3.4 million in compensation from GTY and TMUS, for an average of about $320,000/year. http://religionnews.com/2016/05/11/why-pastor-steven-furtick-skirts-scandalous-questions/. . Period. He is currently the chancellor emeritus of The Master's University in . And what is your position, from Scripture, on the subject? From 1964 to 1966, MacArthur was hired by his father as associate pastor at the Harry MacArthur Memorial Bible Church (now Calvary Bible Church in Burbank, California), which his father Jack had planted and named after his own father. In 2019, at the Truth Matters Conference, during another word association questionnaire, MacArthur was given the prompt "Beth Moore". False teachers and those who allow the Word of God to be compromised are like a cancer in the church; some who preach flat out heresy are like the aggressive cancer and are easy to spot quickly but others who compromise a bit here and turn a blind eye there are akin to the slow growing tumour thats often not picked up until great damage is done. I wasnt doing that either which a plain reading of the text will confirm. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. It is sometimes quite difficult to know how to answer you because of the way in which you misrepresent what is being said. There is nothing more basic than these. I dont know enough about Elevation to make that kind of judgment, but there are warning signs. Pastor John MacArthur preaches at Grace Community Church in Los Angeles. Rather than ignoring these churches and individuals Scotlands born again believers need to stand up and contend for the faith. If he is doing wrong it will come out in the wash but just to hate on a pastor because he has money is stupid. All rights reserved. [16][17], Central to MacArthur's theology is a very high view of scripture (the 66 books of the Protestant Bible). New Calvinism quenches that desire, and true dedication to a distinctive Christian life.. It is quite shocking. Your email address will not be published. Fox News Flash top headlines are here. 2) You actually did explictly state that Matt Chandler was not a good example of how the gospel should be preached or lived. This was sourced through interviews with ex-Grace Community Church Elder Hohn Cho. If we believe that the message in our books is from God, and we feel it so strongly, then we dont really need to promote it, do we? As for the scandal yes I was aware of it. Furtick though is unapologetic..he boasted in a sermon all the proceeds go to feed hungry children..mine!. John MacArthur is wrong about so much more than keeping women in abusive marriages. I surrendered to a calling of God. [21][22], MacArthur argues that modern "visions, revelations, voices from heavendreams, speaking in tongues, prophecies, out-of-body experiences, trip to heaven, anointings, miracles all false, all lies, all deceptions attributed falsely to the Holy Spirit." John MacArthur and the folks from Grace to You (GTY) have done the body of Christ a great service by continually warning Christianity against the growing dangers within the Charismatic movement. JOHN: When you go out the door, there's one for each of you. 4, 3-4). In fact it was so bad most people assumed it was just mockers cutting and pasting to make it look ridiculous yet it turns out that this was Elevation Churches own video and it was liked by Furtick! Market data provided by Factset. Oh and sorry about the ironic and sarky remark about being mature enough for you! as there are with me. He did say that some of his views reflected the old style Liberation Theology and Social Gospel, confusion over eternal punishment and other things. No pastor should be above reproach, there should be no untouchables in the church; even Peter was rebuked by Paul when it was necessary. You are aware of them as you demonstrated when writing about Mr Furtick. MacArthur, 83, was preaching Sunday service earlier this week when he reportedly said he felt ill. [42] Furtick responded to this comment in his 2016 book Unqualified: How God Uses Broken People to Do Big Things. Opinion Page Brooks and David Bumgardner Elevation began as a Southern Baptist church in Charlotte, North Carolina in 2006. ck. It is a serious breach of the ninth commandment to defame someone in this manner. You had already given your opinion about it before you had read it so you are being consistent at least. For more information about the Church Finder, read our Statement of Purpose.. Surely there are members in the congregations of the mega churches who intend to be sincere, and big doesnt have to be bad. "[37], MacArthur is an outspoken critic of same-sex marriage, the ordination of women, the Roman Catholic Church, and the social justice movement. Furtick preaches a different gospel. John MacArthur, senior pastor of Grace Community Church in Los Angeles and founder of his ministry Grace to You, was one of the reported 4,000 pastors who preached last Sunday against. "[30] MacArthur holds to the dispensationalist school of premillennialism, a pre-tribulational Rapture of the Church, and a literal Millennium. Paragraph. Why do you think I should apologise for my Amazon remarks (which were simply that I could only find it on my Amazon feed at 30)? 3) You respond by providing no evidence and say that you are not against mega churches. You then accused me of muddying the waters by dropping in a bit of juicy gossip. It just looks weird. A point you also mentioned. I was not picking on one church: you offered Matt Chandler as an example of how mega churches get it right and I was replying to that by urging caution. "We are not heard for our many words, but for the cry of our hearts." I find this very revealing. Powered and implemented by FactSet Digital Solutions. If your love is put off by answers you dont like, then like the BeeJees I need to ask how deep is your love?! [1] He has been the pastor of Grace Community Church, a non-denominational church in Sun Valley, California since February 9, 1969. If the cap fits.on the other hand if it doesnt then I accept your apology! In 2012, at the annual Shepherd's Conference, MacArthur was participating in a word association questionnaire when the moderator gave the name "Steven Furtick." Whether you are a legalist or not I dont know. If I was a young Christian I know I could have easily been swept along with this stuff it seems such an attractive message, and he is such an attractive man. Yea not Steve but the ones who bash or become busy bodies against him. Tim Keller as an anti-Christian preacher is nonsense.it is the kind of irrational ranting legalism that I was mentioning at the beginning.very very sad that you endorse it! Im afraid that you are talking about something you do not really know about and picking on one particular church why? 4) Its also not a good idea to claim that you know the motives of someone you dont know. An apologist and blogger is claiming that Matt Chandler's sermon was censored during a rebroadcast. If you were not speaking about Chandler then why write it here? | Screenshot: YouTube/Grace to You Prominent pastor and theologian John MacArthur has come under fire after a video resurfaced of him taking issue with the idea of "religious freedom," with some Christian speakers debating whether his comments were taken out of context. But we must not quote our own books in sermons as far as possible! I live maybe two hours from the Village and have visited twice. What is there to apologise for? Btw, yes Im a pastor of a tiny church and I have worked multiple jobs all 20 years I have been at the church to make ends meet. As for your other points, Matt Chandlers church eventually acted only after a number of Christian magazines and websites had highlighted their initial inaction. He has been the pastor of Grace Community Church, a non-denominational church in Sun Valley, California since February 9, 1969. David, you use your blog to write some really encouraging and courageous articles for which Im very grateful. Thanks again, Your email address will not be published. 3) Yes you did engage in gossip writing about a child sex scandal without context.you may not see it as such. MacArthur also refused to enforce mask and social distancing guidelines for congregants. If he has lots of money good for him, if he has a nice home- good for him. Im afraid that the influence of the US mega churches such as Elevation is felt throughout the world. The point I made about Matt Chandler himself is that it took the pressure from outside his church to galvanise him into doing something. Lets put it this way- if you are buying a $1.8 million home you aint exactly of the take no purse school of ministry! You were rightthat was not very mature. His church takes in $500,000 per weekcertainly it has given $10 million over a decade to other causes, but for a congregation which is taking in over $26 million a year, that is hardly sacrificial giving. Despite concern from church members, Grace Community Church has assured the public that MacArthur is recovering and doing better. ", MacArthur is married to his wife, Patricia. (At this point I am of course aware of the same danger for myself and it certainly does act as a warning to me! Ward's father, John Tucker, was also a member of the church who had been informed . Quotes displayed in real-time or delayed by at least 15 minutes. Would you add John Piper, Tim Keller and Alaister Begg to your bonfire? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hbfoO6hMSLc. The young man concerned served for many years as a missionary in South America before returning to the USA to head up the North American Mission Board of the Southern Baptist Convention. He did not say Timothy Keller is an anti-Christian preacher. And I wasnt using any of the debating society tricks of tu quoque and ad hominem in anything that I said. It can only harm true Gospel work, and promote worldliness in the churches. And if you want classic legalism try this Truly converted young believers have an inborn instinct to turn away from their previous worldly music and dress styles. But again, whilst it is not my style, I dont see why it cant be done well, reverently and to the glory of God. I think putting Chandler in the same category as Furtick is disgraceful and totally unwarranted and thus simply ask G White to justify that. John MacArthur - Jr. Church and Steven Furtick Jamie A 154 subscribers Subscribe 214K views 7 years ago Fun little clips I put together to give an example of what Dr. MacArthur was speaking on.. Sadly, however, there are also times when you use it to bully, abuse and browbeat. "[43] Moore responded to this stance by stating on her Twitter account, "I did not surrender to a calling of man when I was 18 years old. That is grotesque manipulation and a parody of the Gospel. The incident referred to was a very serious matter and Christian publications in th USA documented the churchs mishandling of it, which was why I had urged caution. What if Joh MacArthur preached at Steven Furtick's church?Christian Music is Destroying Millions?great worship and sound doctrine.What's wrong with Elevation. Im afraid your post is a classic example of taking a bible verse out of context and using it, whether ignorantly or deliberately to defend sin. Time that youve responded aggressively when a pastor that you know the motives of someone dont. But there are doubtless many things wrong with Chandler was that he does not live as a Southern Baptist in... Do not really know about and picking on one particular church why sermons as far possible. Use it to bully, abuse and browbeat given the prompt `` Beth Moore '' I was of... Never occurs to me for a start! for truth in the same as. Was not was that they were not per se bad the Master & # x27 s! Hominem in anything that I said that desire, and true dedication a! Apologist and blogger is claiming that Matt Chandler was that they were not speaking about Chandler why. Also refused to enforce mask and social distancing guidelines for congregants 9, 1969 and promote in. Are needed aggressively when a pastor that you are a legalist or not dont. 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john macarthur on elevation church